Is 103 degree Celsius the best target temperature fit the PID? Manual Machine Shop. Disconnect the two connectors from the brew thermostat, which is located on the bottom left-hand side of the boiler as you face the machine. PID Kit for older plastic body Gaggia Classic. . View Product Information. KIT-GG Installation Guide Version 1.3 Auber Instruments, 730 Culworth Manor, Alpharetta, GA 30022 e-mail: info@auberins.com Tel: 770-569-8420 www.auberins.com . Hi , I followed the instructions but the PID starts up with some number and it doesnt look normal , LCD just keep blinking some numbers the goes of for a few seconds the I get some numbers for half a second, itso quick I cant tell what is displaying, could I have got the power wiring wrong or if the cable are higher AWG would it causes issue? From the factory, the GC has two thermostats, one for brew, which the thermocouple + PID + SSR replaces, and one for steam, which stays untouched. If you need to replace the PID controller, please contact us. Hello, 6 Reviews (6) $326.00. Does anyone else have this kit? As for your PID always remaining on, it looks like you wired it to the unswitched mains, instead of the switched power. Mains is house current. Hi Jun, and thanks for the update. At a minimum, I think you would need the following: I dont see piggyback connectors on Mr Shades list, maybe those are part of the set of wires, but its not clear. on orders over $49. For the Gaggia Classic, taking into account the temperature drop between the boiler and the group head (5-8 degrees C), the PID target temperature should be set to about 103 degrees C or 220 degrees F at sea level. Its no secret that the chassis of the Classic has extremely sharp edges. The 12 volt wires from the SSR connect to terminals 4 and 5. So a couple of questions after completing everything (I ordered all the same parts from your guide, so hoping everything is the exact same). Everything else (Auber and Mr Shades) includes an M4 thread on their pt100. The Auber kit looks easy since I dont have time to build my own. My install went as smooth as I hoped all my wire colours and locations were identical to yours (Phewf). My next thought was that the controller wasnt reading the correct temperature. Despite the K02 indicating K-type, it was advertised as supporting multiple types including PT100. Close. I purchased an AC to AC SSR (SSR 40AA) which will stabilise steaming temperatures in much smaller margins than the original steam thermostat. New - Gaggia Classic Pro/2019 PID kit - 1/32DIN single display. I am not surprised that the steam kit made little difference. The PID will be more or less bypassed when the steam switch is on, it will just stop trying to heat because the boiler will be over the PIDs target temperature. if a brew alone can do it with some limit to prevent steam from blowing thermal fuse that maybe interesting and simple. 19K Items sold. Is there a way to calibrate the read out close to the water out temperature. You could simulate pre infusion by briefly running the pump. Does this mean that I have made the connection properly? Hi Ray. Only needs 2 x AAA batteries. (PID Temperature Controller Meter Indicator, Jaybva Digital Universal Thermostat C and Fahrenhe F Display SSR and Alarm Output 40A Solid State Relay and Thermocouple Probe Heat Sink Included)? $375.00. Im using a calibrated FLUKE 51II digital thermometer and a K-type thermocouple to measure temp. Following your idea, I have ordered the same type of REX-C100FK02-V*EN and I combined with PT100 (RTD) sensor. https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4243840. I would be glad if you have any recommendations. They have no effect on the temperature during a shot since the heating element cannot respond quickly and accurately enough to manage intrashot temperature control. 5: The PID controller in this kit is NOT SYL-1512A. Best tip from Chris is to remove the bottom screws and using piggyback spades. https://www.vertex-qis.co.uk/Manuals/PT100_con.pdf. Approach 2: Divert from my writeup by installing the thermocouple so that it replaces the steam thermostat, and set the PID temperature to your preferred steam temperature. Pull the steam wand up and out of the Classic, and set it aside. You need a 85-250V DC model, as the power will be coming from the Classic, which is mains-level voltage. The best part is I am only in about $40 on my kit compared to around $150 for the pre made kits. But I wondered if anyone has had the same problem and already found the answer! 102 is way too low, you wont get useful steaming at that low a temperature. As for steam, the guide I wrote leaves the steam function completely untouched. If the PID stays on when wired directly to mains power, you will need to figure out which power wire to tap into. Maybe this will help? Update:This kit is compatible with the latestGaggia Classic Pro (released in 2018/2019) models, including the regular model (RI9380, 120V or 240V) and the European model(RI9480, 240V). Monday - Friday: 10am - 4:30pm. For espresso, 9 bars is the generally preferred pressure. That is confusing. Auber Instruments PID Kit for Gaggia Classic. Unfortunately, no, you cant use the factory sensor. on orders over $49. I then thought what if? and decided to change the mains wires to the opposite terminals. Be careful, the edges of the hole in the chassis are very sharp. Do you think this makes difference? It is a really tight fit to get the REX C-100 PID inside the machine. Auber Instruments PID Kit for Gaggia Classic. You can use the same 18 gauge wire between the heating element and the SSR. I strongly suggest checking which switch terminal switches the mains. The PID itself draws very little current, so something like 18 gauge lamp cord would work. If you want to defeat this feature, please add this optionto your order. Is there an easy way to set a brewing and steam temp? Posted by 2 years ago. I decided that for me, its not worth worrying about. i set an upper an lower limit on alarms. Tap the switched hot/load mains power: disconnect the lower left-hand (if facing the front of the machine) wire from the power switch. The C-100 can accommodate only one sensor/SSR, so you would only set it for brew temperature. Circuit diagram of Gaggia Classic with the KIT-GG connection. I opted to follow my connections according to your picture, rather than that text. They are easy to unlock to get to all of the other settings, there are plenty of instructions on how to do this out there, but I didnt really need to go there. Ive seen another youtube video and its suggesting to piggy back power from the top left-hand wire fro the power switch (if facing the front of the machine) instead of the lower left-hand as you suggested in this article. I cant see why you couldnt. This is an extra piece of wire for the European model of Gaggia Classic Pro (RI9480, 230V) with an energy-saving module, which turns off the machine after about 20 min if not used). Fortunately, no damage done, and you can easily revert your changes. Tap the neutral mains: disconnect the lower wire from the mains connector at the back of the Classic. I completed the installation last night and like you it too me about 5 hours But this included cutting a hole in the case stainless steel case to mount the PID controller internally, and that was probably the most time-consuming and difficult thing. This guide should generally also apply to the 2013 GC, but you must assume that any of the switch wiring that I describe will be different for your model year. 6 Reviews (6) $375.00. Applications The YouTube video from wll about replacing the boiler made the whole thing very easy. This PID-SSR combination does away with the 12v connection, and uses three wires for the mains power and SSR, with one wire shared between mains and the SSR output. On top of the original price tag, international shipping, taxes, duties and currency exchanges can make obtaining these kits time consuming and even more expensive. If you also need features such as steam temperature control, pre-infusion, and countdown timer, please checkKIT-GGPpre-infusion kit. I have briefly thought about pre-infusion but the REX C-100 is not capable of this. 3. Like you I dialed my brew temperature in until I got the results I wanted, at that point it doesnt really matter if the temperature is calibrated or not, as long as it tastes great. D 9. Have you written an article regarding installing a Gaggiuino mod? I was like WTF. Net Weight: about 150g I had to manually enable autotuning on my REX-C100 and i dont know if other values are screwed up or if its something else, since it really does seem like the boiler is getting power in bypass of whatever the PID is doing. If so, any idea how it can be achieved? Youre giving up one of the two temperature readouts, so youll probably only see the actual temperature, as opposed to the target temperature, and I guess you can switch between the two with a button press. For the Classic Pro, this requires either shortening the spring in the OPV valve through trial and error, or ordering a spring kit from Mr. If you really want to avoid the heating element switching while youre pulling a shot, you can blip the steam switch for a few seconds before brewing and that will bring the boiler temperature up a few degrees. Either way, you are looking at a lot more complexity and cost. I appreciate the write up, and I believe it will help people doing this upgrade. A copy of the digital manuals, which includes a detailed installation guide, an operation manual, and supplementary documents. I ran the Autotuning function couple of times and I am always getting the following values for P, I and D parameters: P=620 , I=32, D=8. Shall I connect it to terminal 5 or 2 of the on-off switch? Note: I fully tested the PID, SSR and thermocouple on the workbench before final installation. Please be sensible and install a grommet anyway! You should be able to find the switched mains with the help of a multimeter. I have a 2012 and am wondering if you had success and if the wires are as described in the article. Log in or sign up to leave a comment. (The Gaggia machine is not included in this listing). This will give the REX-C100 enough time to auto-tune its PID settings for the boiler. This kit doesn't control the steam temperature nor has the pre-infusion function. My steam bottoms out around 130 or so, and I dont start steaming until 135-145. The SSR is just a fancy switch and it should only be turning on and off, so depending on how you measure you may not see current. Im all for freedom of expression and creativity, but not when it might electrocute someone. Hi Joe. After autotuning, my values are: Wear a glove when reaching in from below, otherwise bloodletting is likely. Please see our Help Center's. Did you try it? But will there be an upper limit to prevent the boiler from going near 365F and blowing thermal. Again, as above, run this cable out the back, and leave it unterminated and longer than needed. You can search on Reddit, a few people have made these modifications. Hi Justin. The connector is on the back of the machine, where mains power is tapped with a piggyback connector and goes to the PID. Ill verify the cable, its one of the cables that came with the machine, so it could likely be the strands have slowly burned with time and just needs cutting and re-crimping, as you mention. Chris, this is a far simpler way to add preinfusion. I also think that you may have less difficulty reaching the thermostat, the 2019+ models have a lot less room to spare inside. Same with the adapter screw. However, depending on the seller, some settings may need to be changed. Perhaps your steam thermostat is indeed not working quite as well as expected. Thanks heaps for the detailed instructions. SSR control ready to connect external Solid State Relay to handle High current. I agree the ability to know exactly where the steam cycle is at is a nice convenience. Stock situation: Silver case : Last one or two!!! The thermocouple connects to terminals 6 and 7. One question, Ever thought about adding a pre infusion feature? But this kit doesn't fit the European model RI9403, which has a stainless steel boiler with a different thermostat mounting. I like the quality of the shots, and temperature consistency is more important to me than pressure consistency. It has a blue led not red like pictured.The kit works for 115 VAC and 240VAC. Thanks. So I pulled the thermocouple and checked it in hot water against two food/oven thermometers I have. Thanks for the quick reply. Shades. For the sake of piece of mind, I have ordered last night a K type thermocouple in order to replace the RTD P100 and close the open loop in my head about PID type and sensor. Then use the left/right buttons to select the digits to increase and decrease, and the up/down buttons to change the digits. The Gaggia Classic is a very capable espresso machine that gets even better with a couple of improvements. My theory at the moment would be that due to the PID control the heater is sometimes on at higher temperatures. Keep the thermostat, in case you want to return the Classic back to factory condition. SKU: N/A Category: Accessories,Espresso Machines Tags: -GG-CLASSIC-PCB, $100-$300, $200-$300, 12annivexcluded, 13tierexcl, 300-600, Accessories, auber-instruments, gaggia, obalist, SA-GG-CLASSIC-P, SA-GG-CLASSIC-PCR, . Hi Chris, i noticed you used the K type thermocouple with the M4. As for you steam mode question, if you followed this guide for installing your PID, the PID will have no effect on the the steam temperatures or functions. I have few questions for you about this setup. If anyone is 3d printing the enclosure and doesnt want to tape or otherwise attach it to the Gaggia, I have made these small hooks that can be glued on to the enclosure: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4938828. When the ">" key is pressed, the controller starts the brewing sequence automatically. Gaggia Classic Pro (released in 2018/2019) models, How to Download Manuals for Login-Required Kits, Temperature Controller for Weber Smokey Mountain/ Akorn, PID KIT for Gaggia Classic Pro & Classic & Home w/ pre-infusion, Automobile Multimeter for EGT, Boost, Red, Universal 1/32 DIN PID Temperature Controller. I plan to do this shortly for my old gaggia classic. (Gaggia Classic) Close. I think this is why using a separate SSR and controller is the only way to go. Do you think this makes a difference? Each segmentcan be set by the user with 0.1 seconds resolution. Its not elegant, but does the job to give you a pretty good relative temperature to aid your temp surfing. Although this is optional, it is difficult to access the power switch to tap power for the PID, and it is almost impossible to reach the thermostat without moving the boiler, and the boiler cant be moved unless the steam wand is removed. Here are some pictures of the Lego enclosure: https://www.reddit.com/r/espresso/comments/owpfe7/i_made_a_lego_enclosure_for_rex_c100_pid/. Feedback is that there are almost no two GCs with identical wiring, even units destined for the same power rating. With a PID controller added to the heater control circuit, brew water temperature can be controlled to within 1 accuracy. I started with 103, and bumped it up to 105. This prompted me to look for alternate solutions. I am only using the Rex temporarily while working on a project with a Raspberry Pi (and the cost of the Rex was only a couple dollars when ordering the SSR), otherwise I would reprint the entire enclosure with the hooks built in. 2. 18 comments. Im running into problems and I dont know if my REX-C100s starting values are the problem or if its my deviation with the wiring: Regardless of the temperature that i set on my PID, toggling the Gaggia on causes it to climb to 150-160C and then slowly decline to 118-125C, at which time it will heat up again. Rancilio SilviaPID. Leave the Classic powered on for at least 15 minutes. Connect one meter probe to ground (the GC chassis should always be grounded, otherwise connect to the green wire coming from the power socket at the back). Thermocouple: J,S,K,E,Wre3 ~ Wre25 save. These wires will be connected to the solid state relay later on, so they no longer need to be in the bottom of the machine. Does the wiring youve supplied automatically shut the PID unit off when you engage the steam switch? But nothing prevents you from using the PID and thermocouple as a temperature indicator. Pull the cover assembly off by pulling upwards, and disconnect the ground cables. Between SSR and PID I was planning on using 22 awg wire given its a lower power requirement. Its actually reading too high.. 98 deg against 92deg measured by both my oven thermometers. Supposed to be faster in detecting temperature changes and more accurate with the measurement. Some people have done this by replacing the water filler funnel and 3D printing a replacement cover. Heres how to install a PID on the Gaggia Classic Pro. I agree, the PID is a gamechanger. $326.00. Hi Gene. The enclosures purpose is first to protect you from the mains current, and second, to make it easier to attach the PID to the Gaggia. These are located around the shower screen. Inside the GC, all bets are off as to wire colors, aside from green for ground, and even then, I wouldnt assume anything. The preinfusion thing is a bit ridiculous, it just turns your pump on, off and on again. Somebody else (Andrue) had also pointed this error out. The steam mode has its own thermostat, which is very similar to the brew thermostat that the PID replaced, except that its temperature range is more or less as you described. https://wiki.wholelattelove.com/File:GAGGIA_CLASSIC_2019_Wiring_Schematic.pdf I deliberately avoided looking at the Mr Shades kits and instructions when I wrote this article, I dont want to steer people away from them. have you had any issues with the k type or have heard of this? That is indeed not normal. I had no issues with the K type thermocouple. GAGGIA Classic 2021 550.00 , : PID KIT 129.17 , Top Box 35.00, OPV KIT . Because the PID runs on mains voltages, an enclosure is required. A Gaggia Classic Pro installed with KIT-GGP. I know the numbering labels on mine didnt make much sense, and you will also notice in the picture in this article that even the polarity order between the SSR terminals and the thermocouple terminals are mirrored. However I now need to connect steaming and brewing circuits in parallel rather than serial because steaming circuit will not be closed unless I turn on steaming switch and supply power to steaming SSR. This is sold on amazon however the one SSR is nice and the modification gives upgraded steam with the solder mod. This approach would make your machine a bit weird to someone who wasnt aware of what you did, as the brew function would be completely unusable without adjusting the temperature. For me I start steaming when the boiler temperature reads 130 degrees C. So for others who are contemplating going for the extra effort of installing the steam PID, know that the return on investment of doing this is questionable, if not net negative. What you describe is pretty normal, except that I am a bit surprised that your steam drops temperature down to 102. Thanks again for the write up, Ill be playing around with temperature for the next week! Did you try with the SSR unit 40 DA or 40AA? Before replacing the thermostat, maybe check whether your PID and thermocouple are calibrated, before committing to buying more parts. Remove the thermostat. I will monitor it over the next few days, but if the coffee takes good, and the only thing I notice is the warmer cup tray, Ill be fine with that, better in fact! The only cable arrangement I had to change after installing the PID was switching those cables in the back, the one on the top I had to put in the bottom, and the one on the bottom in the top, otherwise the PID would stay on when the machine was off, and off when the machine was on. Is it possible to do this with the GC factory temp sensor? Hi Tom. Then the PID will only switch on when the boiler temperature drops below the target temperature. Or is the only power available from the mains? Then use the cursor keys to select the digits to increase and decrease. Also some pids come with a built in relay. Its crazy. the PWM needs a new wire to the where the pump wire was disconnected. Never used a K type so I cant say for sure. When the pump runs, it vibrates the chassis and it will be a matter of time before it cuts through the wiring insulation. My Gaggia Classic uses 18 awg wire for every connection inside. QB-T7100 48*24mm Programmable Digital PID Temperature Controller AC/DC 85-250V 1: This kit fits the Gaggia Classic Pro (RI9380/46, released in early 2019), Gaggia Classic & Home (which has the traditional Gaggia aluminum boiler)including 14101, RI8161/40, and RI9303 models. The best way to find is: 1-Connect one cable to the mains connector at the back where it is showing N sign meaning Neutral. The two mains wires connect to terminals 1 and 2 (starting counter-clockwise from top-left). After the kit is installed, the standby brew watertemperaturecan be controlled to within 1 (F or C) accuracy. Basic tools screwdrivers, pliers, a socket wrench, and a small amount of rubbing alcohol. Plug in a mains-rated wire connected to a piggyback spade connector, and then plug the original neutral cable into the piggyback. If you go for a PID, you need to use a thermocouple. For the Gaggia Classic, taking into account the temperature drop between the boiler and the group head (5-8 degrees C), the PID target temperature should be set to about 103 degrees C or 220 degrees F at sea level. However with the new steaming alarm system, I get a decrease around 10 degrees in steaming temperature as soon as AA SSR shuts down the boiler at the temperature I set, even it turns on right away (my setting is AL:156 AH:155 degrees Celcius). Left or right side if facing the front of the machine? I am flattered, but will have to pass. That controller is an interesting find. Cheers. Hi Kez. Thank you very much if you find the time to answer me . 4.8. Thanks again for all your support. 1 RELAY alarm: Normal open, capacity 250V/3A AC or 30V/3A DC The countdown extraction timer contains three segments: pre-infusion pulse (Tp), soak (Td), and brew (Tb). The digits to increase and decrease, and countdown timer, please checkKIT-GGPpre-infusion kit,... Pid control the steam wand up and out of the shots, and consistency. - Gaggia Classic uses 18 awg wire for every connection inside the starts... Wiring insulation wiring, even units destined for the pre made kits temperature down to.! Little difference for my old Gaggia Classic is a really tight fit to get the C-100! Not worth worrying about and it will be a matter of time before it cuts through the insulation... Steam thermostat is indeed not working quite as well as expected moment would that... 102 is way too low, you will need to figure out which power to! Replacement cover for steam, the controller wasnt reading the correct temperature a blue not! 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